A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy š
If your post meets the following criteria, itās welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
Icon by @Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de
- 0 users online
- 263 users / day
- 971 users / week
- 2.46K users / month
- 5.6K users / 6 months
- 1 subscriber
- 3.07K Posts
- 119K Comments
- Modlog
I was raised Roman Catholic, but am feeling much better now.
Iām an atheist because religion describes our reality about as well as Flat Earthers describe the shape of our planet.
Same boat but I have heavily leaned towards science. And I think that leaning hard that way has kinda pushed me into being agnostic more than atheist. Have you had similar thoughts?
My faith corroded as my critical thinking skills developed. Iād consider myself a strong atheist on the Dawkins scale.
I havenāt seen anything that would nudge me off of my position towards agnosticism.
Strong atheist. Not only I believe there are no Gods, I think religions are bad for humanity and society as a whole.
With you on this.
I donāt think religion causes war, but I definitely think itās used as an excuse to do unthinkable things to living, breathing and feeling people en masse, not to mention the damage to the planet and itās other inhabitants. Like you say religion is used to control people, people are willing to die for their religion, willing to turn on their children or vice versa.
Though I do get that for some people it brings them hope, allows them to be part of a community and other benefits. And even though it also fuels pure hatred, bigotry and racism and gives people personal allowances to commit atrocities. I wouldnāt hold any negative feelings to those that do choose to take part in religion. Providing the religion stops before the evil starts, nothing too extreme, ya know. Thereās a line but hard to say where itās drawn.
To add to this the absolute worst thing religion does is try to force itself on others. Wouldnāt be such a bad thing if it was just kept to itself. But nope. Like the saying; religion is like a penis, itās fine to have one, itās fine to be proud of it. But if you start waving it around outside and start trying to push it down my throat, weāre going to have a problem!
Buddhism. I first learned about it when someone was discussing whether itās a religion or a way of life. They specifically mentioned that it doesnāt necessarily prevent you from being Christian (which I was) at the same time.
3 years later and I disagree with that statement, to a certain extent. You could choose to ignore the āsupernaturalā parts of Buddhism and just learn from the lessons. But I think the more you learn, the more it just kinda makes sense.
For instance, buddhist believe in āre-incarnationā but thereās a lot of debate about what that is. I prefer death and rebirth. Which I interpret as: Iām a different person than I was 10 years ago. The old me died and was reborn as what I am now.
Other things that I like about it: it is encouraged that you have skeptisicm about what you learn. Iām fact, you shouldnāt just accept it because without questioning what your being told, you can not come to a true understanding and belief. The lessons all revolve around how to be a better person. How to achieve nirvana through your thoughts, actions, views, etc. Many of the principles were first introduced when buddha was alive 2500 years ago. Today, psychology studies have shown that many of them really do have long lasting, extremely beneficial effects. Think meditation and mindfulness (not necessarily invented by Buddhism, but popularized by it)
For me it really resonates. A lot of the things I care about are discussed. From mental health to treating life with respect to the environment to forgiveness. I also donāt find much hipocracy.
You put why Buddhism resonates with me into such good terms.
I think that interpretation (dying and being reborn as a new āyouā) in particular resonates with me on both a physical and spirit/soul level. While there are fundamental parts of us that remain for long periods of time, our bodies are constantly breaking down and rebuilding themselves on a cellular level, and on a more personal level, our minds are constantly growing, changing, evolving, and forgetting as we learn and experience new things. Iām still not entirely sure what death as an experience will be like, but looking at it this way (the current or future āmeā ending and taking on some new form) makes the most sense right now.
Mental health and personal growth-wise, I also really like the focus it has not on worshipping a certain being or beings, but about learning, understanding, and trying to be a good person. It makes things feel more⦠reachable, if that makes sense. More down-to-earth.
For sure. You arenāt supposed to āworshipā buddha in the same way as gods from other religions. Rather he is seen as a role model.
Dude, I came here to write the same as you but you were faster and definitely wrote WAY better then Iām capable to do.
Pastafarian. Iāve preferred alfredo to marinara ever since I was a kid and loved pirates. I just knew that my colander had a sacred use: as a hat!
Apatheism.
āBecause God said soā sounds like a terrible rationale for morality to me. For that reason I do not think the existence of God is relevant to my life.
Raised mormon, did the mission thing, moroniās promise was bullshit so I switched to general christianity, realized that itās just another brand of bullshit. Currently agnostic/atheist/who cares.
IF thereās a god, heās not a fucking primate with a sphincter- humans are so freaking narcissistic to think the āultimateā being of all time is just like them.
IF thereās a god, why would he be omniscient/omnipresent? You created this post, do you actively control how it interacts with peopleās minds?
IF thereās a god, and heās the christian idea of a god, heās evil. No loving being would send their āchildrenā to a test (omniscient, knowing the future) knowingly sending them to a place where the result would be them suffering for eternity.
IF thereās a god, their existence doesnāt answer the question of where we came from, what came before god? If your answer to this question is āgod just always wasā youāre an idiot who missed the point.
Dudeism. Regarding what led me to identify with it, well, you know. A lotta ins, a lotta outs, a lotta what-have-yous, and uhh⦠lost my train of thought there.
It really ties the room together.
NULL
None. My family and basically everyone in my rural hometown were on the spectrum from āquiteā to āextremelyā protestant Christian. None of it was compatible with my brain, none of it ever made sense at all. Iāve been areligious as long as I can remember and hereās hoping I never get a brain tumor, because Iām pretty sure thatās the only way I will ever become religious.
However, Iām a big fan of people retaining their full agency and that includes leaving people to believe whatever they want. Iām not at all militant and outside of the fact that a large percentage of the worldās religious population would probably want me dead or, at minimum, thinks Iām incapable of having any sense of morality, or thinks that my children should be indoctrinated, etc. etc. Other than all that kind of stuff, I really do not care what they believe. Unitarian Universalists seem pretty cool though.
Man, do I hate that with such a burning passionā¦
Like, the amount of times Iāve had to sit someone down and go āIām not a decent human being because The Bible showed me to be or because my local priest told me Iād burn in Hell if I wasnāt, Iām a decent human being because my ma raised me to beābecause her mom raised her to be that way, and so on. She never threatened me with fire and brimstone nor told me itās what Jesus would have wanted, just that people ought to be kind to one another. God didnāt teach me manners and how to be kind to others, she did.ā is unreal. How itās so hard for people to grasp is beyond me
Also, the indocternation of children without thier consent makes my blood boil. Itās cool if they believe in Christ, Allah, Brahma, or none of the aboveā¦but that should be thier own choice, not something chosen for them. āCome freely of your own willā and all that. Because if youāre forced to love something for fear of punishment, is it really love?
Currently none, I consider myself agnostic. Grew up protestant christian, left the church last year due to not identifying with its beliefs (and to save church tax). I have a casual interest in Buddhism, but donāt plan on actually converting.
Some sort of humanist atheism/existentialism? I guessā¦
As a teenager and young adult, I used to be very interested in cosmology and astrophysics, to the point I wanted to study it at uni. The vastness of the world and existence seemed like a beautiful enigma. I was also always interested in philosophy, which ended up more lasting than my interest in physics.
After growing older, the vastness of nature and existence seemed more and more haunting than beautiful. If there was something like a God, it had to be a mad idiot god. I actually kind of sympathised with Gnosticism and similar thoughts for a while, but I could not believe in a metaphysical, perfect entity waiting even further behind everything. I could not believe in some sort of salvation, that could just come to us by giving up on materiality. It seemed like an empty self-delusion. Similarly, I respect Buddhism a lot, and think there is a lot of good ideas within it, but itās ultimate life-nonaffirming philosophies and focus on avoidance of suffering did not resonate with me.
Looking at the history of our planet, our universe, and humanity, it seemed clear to me, that existence just stumbles along. We are a āmistakeā in a vastness of empty, dumb, boring clouds of hydrogen and dust, nuclear furnaces and holes in reality, devoid of meaning. Life felt more and more to me, like a great rebellion against a vast, seemingly all-encompassing nothingness. No aliens in sight either, that could relieve us of our burden. Just humanity, as the one lifeform so far known to us, that at least has the potential to not fall into the traps of self-annihilation and lifelessnes that permeates our past and present. Just humanity with the responsibility of getting our shit together or life eventually being just reincorporated into the vast, dumb nothing of the āidiot godā, so to speak.
All the mistakes of humans felt to me more and more like just extensions of the same stupidity that is also manifest in all of nature. And our struggle against it, feels like a sort of āsacred dutyā. Those loaded words to illustrate, that Iād think of myself as actually having strong faith in a weird way, even though it is not rooted in the supernatural as such.
Itās also evident to me, this faith has at least partially persisted for me as an anchor for myself. I have not been suicidal ever since I felt that way, even though for most of my life I have been struggling with trauma and a variety of mental health disorders, and have been suicidal before. I could not think of that anymore, suffering seemed almost meaningless to me, now, and it feels better to endure it than to give in to the vast nothingness without a fight, without trying to create as much good as possible in this small contingent miracle that is life, that has been brought forth by so much struggle and so many seemingly impossible coincidences, chance and āmistakesā.
I have a big aversion against beliefs that put faith into higher powers, be it nature or God or some sort of transdimensional aliens or whatever. I try to analyse beliefs like that not with disdain, though, but as results of how we are caught in the world we are, in our circumstances, and how life itself has had to ātrickā existence itself into allowing life to exist, by follwing its rules but also emergently transcending them, creating something new from it, that is more than the sum of its parts.
Politically and philosophically it lead me to Marxism and Hegel respectively. Marxism with itās focus on changing our material foundations and dynamics, in order for us to be able to develop our humanity and be able to act more rational in the grand scheme lends itself well to it. Hegel, with looking at the development of ideas and humanity dialectically, developing something until it reaches the limit of its own contradictions also appealed to me.
Sorry for the wall of text, the question caught me in a somber mood and caused me to monologue.
Thanks for the awesome wall though.
Iām finding it really interesting reading other peopleās journey with this stuff, and I relate to the pain that working through it creates
Atheist.
No arguments that Iāve heard for the existence of a deity have met their burden of proof. For some of these deities (the Abrahamic god, gods of most eastern religions, Zeus, Xenu), I actively assert they do not exist, while for others (e.g. a deistic god) I canāt honestly claim they donāt exist due to the lack of falsifiable claims involved, but I still donāt believe claims that they do exist.
Atheist. Raised catholic. Too old, I realized that the god of the bible isnāt a moral person. 1 Samuel 15:3 etc. Arguing with young-earth creationists gave me the final push, I understood science well enough to understand the implications of radiometric dating, plate tectonics, geology etc.
Atheist, if you consider that a religion. I view it more as a lack of religion or belief, but thatās just pedantry. I was raised a Jehovahās Witness, but eventually became disillusioned with their teachings as I grew older and realized that they were out of touch with the Bible and (more importantly) reality. After a period of self-reflection, I examined what I believe and came to the conclusion that I didnāt really believe in much of anything anymore.
I donāt believe in the Bible. Itās a great work of literature, in an academic sense, but itās not something to model your life on. You can tie yourselves up in knots trying to come up with a coherent interpretation or you can take everything so figuratively that you might as well ignore the source material all together. I didnāt see much point in either and just view it as a product of the wide range of people over the millennia that contributed to it.
I donāt believe in God either. For me, I donāt see a reason to think that there is a God. Itās essentially impossible to prove that God doesnāt exist. If you disproved one, people would just come up with either excuses or another God entirely. Some might argue that Earthās existence implies the existence of a creator. Assuming that was true, wouldnāt the existence of this creator imply the existence of a second creator for the first? Why should we accept that God had no creator but that the universe had to have a creator?
There are other arguments, sure, but my lived experience has shown me no reason to think that thereās a God or specific meaning, plan, scheme, or rhyme and reason to life on Earth. That doesnāt mean we canāt find meaning in our own lives, but it does mean we have to work to make it.
Nobody is coming to save us. Nobody is going to hand us an answer or salvation. We have to save ourselves.
It is not merely the existence of the earth that implies it, but the fact that it has a beginning. Thereās other evidence in physics and thermodynamics that the universeās beginning could be explained with an external trigger. The fact that the universe does not stretch endlessly into the past, and thereās a beginning of ātimeā does allude to the possibility of a creator.
This logic may not apply to the creator themselves, as thereās no evidence that they have a beginning too, and they donāt need one to be a creator. In fact, it makes more sense that they donāt.
But this is all very hand wavy in the end. I donāt mean to say it is certain. But I do think thereās a good argument for it.
Why do you think the universe needs a beginning, but there are special rules for your god because of?.. magic?
One of the primary assertions of the Big Bang Theory is that the universe has a beginning, and it is thus far the most widely accepted explanation of the origin of the universe.
Also please tone down the passive aggression. No one said anything about magic, and this isnāt Reddit :)
But thatās a theory isnāt it? I havenāt seen any scientific theories to gods how do we know anything about a god, much less what the nature of their being? Itās just not based on anything, (therefore my allusions to magic)
I donāt enjoy your tone policing⦠There are ways to do that without sounding pretentious and holier than though, please keep that in mind for the next time.
Yes it is a scientific theory (not a hypothesis), which means it is the widely accepted explanation by scientists.
Youāre right that the theory is not about God, but explains the origins of the universe. What I said about God is what I think is a logical conclusion. If something has a beginning, then it must have been kickstarted somehow. What kickstarted it is by definition its creator. And this applies to our universe, in my opinion.
This does not reveal the nature of the creator or anything about them. It is merely a statement that they must exist. An effect must have a cause.
I apologize for sounding pretentious earlier, that was not my intention, but I can see how it came off as such. And apologize for misunderstanding your intentions as well.
Also I notice you have some downvotes. Just want to clarify that it is not me.
How so? I donāt see what you mean here, it doesnāt explain anything, it just builds a level of assumptions on top of something, basically explaining something with an untested hypothesis.
If you Agree to the premises I guess, but I donāt, so it explains nothing.
Then who kickstarted god? Or does he/she/it for some reason get special treatment here? (This is special pleading)
If I kick a stone down a hill I did not create the stone even though I set it in motion.
Hmm, I donāt see how you evade an infinite regression here, unless you break your own rules and give one link in the chain an āeternal always existingā modifier. We donāt know that anything eternal exist, or even that our universe isnāt eternal (extisting eternally as a singularity before spreading or a part of a bigger multiverse that we cannot perceive)
It is just assuming that something must exist, since youāre building your logic on very shaky premises that we cannot prove.
Must it? Or have we just never seen the contrary (black swan fallacy) Who caused god? like I said before you canāt get away from that without special pleading.
Water under the bridge :) No worries :)
No worries, I donāt care about the votes, interactions are worth way more than someone clicking an arrow :)
Is it true that the Big Bang asserts that the universe had a beginning? True, we donāt know much about the pre-Big Bang universe, but we donāt have a reason to think that it didnāt exist.
Reformed Christian. I was raised in a Christian family, and always believed in the basic concepts of God, heaven, hell, etc. But I mistakenly thought Christianity was about trying to be āgood enoughā for God until my mid teens. Around this time I realised that I couldnāt be perfect, which was super distressing for a time. But then I read Ephesians 2:8-9 which says:
This was a big relief, as it meant that I didnāt need to rely on trying to be good enough for God. I just needed to accept Godās free gift of salvation. Thatās the moment I would say I became a Christian.
Since then, Iāve had times where Iāve questioned it all, but I always come back to the resurrection of Jesus. I find the non-miraculous explanations of the resurrection account to be so implausible that it makes more sense to accept that itās a historical fact. And if the resurrectionās true, then it makes sense to believe the rest of it as well.
I have had bad experiences with Christianity personally such that it has left a permanent bad taste in my mouth, but it makes me happy to see people like you, who have found genuine solace in some of its teachings.
This seems like faulty logic to me. What other things in your life do you affirmatively believe āby defaultā just because their counter-arguments seem implausible to you? Doesnāt it make more sense to not hold belief in something until you have evidence supporting that belief?
Itās not so much that I believe it āby defaultā. Rather, when Iāve examined the historical case for the resurrection, the arguments that it really happened seem stronger than the arguments that it was a hoax, or a mass hallucination, or that he fainted etc.