A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy š
If your post meets the following criteria, itās welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
Icon by @Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de
- 0 users online
- 222 users / day
- 937 users / week
- 2.44K users / month
- 5.59K users / 6 months
- 1 subscriber
- 3.07K Posts
- 119K Comments
- Modlog
Honestly, everything about it. Sometimes I feel like Iām talking to rocks or something, when I try to explain that my brain is literally build different, that I just canāt go and focus or being on time or whatever and people just like āyou donāt even tryā I do try, if I didnāt try like they say I would be dead. šµ
No Iām not trolling you, I literally do not remember what you asked me to do. I donāt care if you asked me 30 seconds ago; I legitimately forgot and I apologize for that.
Yes I know, I should just knock it out now before I forget again, but my low dopamine levels wonāt let me. No Iām not just being lazy; you might as well ask me to move a mountain. Thatās just how difficult is for me to complete the most basic of chores. It is completely out of my control, and no amount of Adderall will fix it.
The wife and I have this argument all the time and it drives me crazy.
How do I upvote a million times?
It isnāt fun.
Yeah, all the stereotypes of the wacky ADHD guy squirrel lol, but itās not like that on the inside.
We are lost in the goddamn fog, chasing phantoms and mirages that disappear when you look at them too long. We are constantly running to catch up and flailing for context. What looks capricious and funny is mostly just desperation. We arenāt bursting with unlimited energy, itās as exhausting as it looks. Taking five attempts to actually get a task done because you just forget halfway through. Forgetting where you put the thing, every time. Feeling your working memory slip away like waking from a dream. Fucking up all the time, then having to work twice as hard to fix it, and feeling like shit because you canāt get anything right.
It gets old, man.
Itās comments like this that make me think I donāt have ADHD and Iām just a bit slow.
My therapist says Iām likely ADHD and I align with a lot in this thread, but this description is about 1000% more dramatic than my day to day life. I guess itās all a spectrum, but Iāve never felt like Iām living in a fog, Iām very very aware of all of the things Iām fucking up, but my mind doesnāt tell my body itās worth fixing yet.
I never āforgetā to finish a task, I remember that task needs to get done every 5 mins after I leave it not finished and it pains me to look at it every time I walk by it. But there are more important things to do. Like scrolling Lemmy or IG.
Your third paragraph is describing executive dysfunction, a symptom of ADHD.
I had a nervous breakdown in university, where I had gotten a huge, highly selective merit scholarship under strict performance conditions. I had thrived - relatively speaking - in a traditional classroom, because it was so structured. I murdered tests because it was quiet, structured, and distraction free. Homework was hit or more frequently miss, I struggled socially, and although clearly not malicious my teachers gently noted that my classroom behavior could be a challenge āto the other studentsā learningā, but I was brilliant enough at tests and classwork and highly motivated by my toxic dysfunctional house to get out that I had successfully gotten my golden ticket.
University, where you had to set and enforce your own structure? I couldnāt cope. I got a lot of flack on āyou never learned to studyā, āyou just donāt know how to do really hard things, now that it isnāt easy for youā. I missed deadlines for administrative work, I forgot assignments, I struggled to remember the instructions to follow them.
I remember a day just before I hit that wall - I was in the study cubicles in the library, trying to work on some critical midterms for a challenging course. I only had the cubicle rental for a set amount of time and needed to meet my long-suffering roommate for a ride home at a given time - they were also very busy and I was not helping their life by being late to everything constantly. I checked the time to see how much longer I had and went back to writing, but realized I hadnāt actually internalized the time so I checked again. Within 10 seconds I couldnāt remember how long I had again, so I checked again - tried really hard to remember! Said it out loud, was shushed by my cube neighbor. Looked up at them - forgot time. Checked again, pen to paper to write it down - I had forgotten already.
Frustrated as hell, I got up to get a drink at the water fountain, hoping the walk and the water would āclear my headā. At this point I had forgotten I even needed to check the time. I sat back down at my cubicle, picked up my pen to start writing for this midterm, began brainstorming ā I was at the water fountain again, although I didnāt remember choosing to go or any of the not-short walk there. Puzzled but not surprised, I thought āI must have been thirstier than I knewā, and made sure to get a BIG drink this time. Walked back to the cubicle. Pick up pen. āFocusā. Deep breath. Consider the themes of ā
I am back at the water fountain. Hand to heaven I did not choose to be here. I do not NEED to be here. I am not thirsty. I return back to my cube without getting a drink because āI am not rewarding myself for wasting timeā.
I walk back to the wrong cubicle because I have forgotten the cubicle number I rented.
I end up back at the water fountain trying to remember my cubicle by retracing my steps - itās not like I havenāt walked that path half a dozen times today already, how did I just now forget??
I get another drink. I finally make it back to my cubicle. I start working on the midterm again, but in the-reading the prompt sheet realize I have not been working on the prompt I actually signed up for this whole time - not that I have written even a paragraph yet. Frustrated to tears after years of this constantly and feeling like a failure, my phone buzzes angrily - somehow during all of this NOTHING, 4 hours came and went, and I am now late to meet my roommate, who is threatening to leave without me.
When I finally finish the paper, it is submitted by my professor for a ābest paper of the semesterā award and places second.
2 months later, seeing the campus psychiatrist after my mental breakdown due to āoverwhelming anxietyā, he listens to me for 45 minutes. He promises we will talk about the anxiety, which is very real and distressing, but also maybe I should consider this other thing. He takes a paper from his filing cabinet, folds over the top so I canāt see what the title is, and presents me with a questionnaire asking me to rate myself from one to five on every moral failing that has ever disappointed and frustrated me and everyone who claims to love me. I am sobbing within 5 questions ā there is a name for this?? This is treatable?? Iām not just a lazy failure?? No, I have no idea what the title of this questionnaire would be.
āAdult ADHD Assessmentā.
Most people, it turns out, DONāT have a childhood nickname of āspace cadetā or ānutty professorā, can finish a sentence in a linear fashion, can sit relatively still, donāt interrupt their psychiatrist 5 times in 20 minutes, and can remember what they have and have not discussed in a 45 minute time window. It also turns out that being a high achiever in a strict scholarship program as a member of the honors college in a challenging major at a prestigious university with āthe WORST case of ADHD I have ever seenā is not super easy, although I canāt imagine why.
Within days I am on my first day of Adderall, although I am told not to expect much at this dose. I almost forget to take it, but my roommate forcefully reminds me as we drive, and I never remembered to take the prescription out of my bag so I still have it. I walk the 15 minutes from the lot to the library.
As I pass the student union building next to the library, I realize something absolutely insane - I know where I am right now, and I remember getting here. Not that I remember every leaf or face I passed, but it isnāt like the water fountain where I only know that I went somewhere because I am now there. Despite having the same routine every day of walking to the library to rent my cubicle first thing, I often āovershootā and accidentally walk past it and head to the buildings for my major without getting my rental and storing my bag, usually only remembering where I am and what Iām doing once I go to open the door of my first class and see that it isnāt my class in there yet - Iām supposed to be studying in the library for a few hours more.
But not on Adderall - on 10 whole mg of Adderall I successfully went right where I was supposed to be on purpose at the right time and I remembered doing it, and it was so unfamiliar an experience that I cried on a bench in the quad about it.
Mine isnāt this bad, but I can relate to the first-day-on-Adderall thing. It was wild when I walked into my messy bathroom an hour after that first dose and my brain just went: āIt is possible, even reasonable for you to clean this bathroom, in a finite amount of time, without every moment filling you with dread. This task will not consume your whole
lifeday.ā My brain had simply never done that before. I could just choose to do something andāperhaps more importantlyāto stop doing something. I remember I washyperfixatingworking on a hobby project at 11 PM on a work night and my brain went: āIf you stop working now, brush your teeth and go to bed, this fun project will still be here for you to work on tomorrow. You donāt have to keep at it until 6 AM and then go to work without sleeping.ā That seemed like such a foreign concept at the time. It was weird to hear that from my own brain, not in a āyouāre being badā way, but in a āitās going to be okayā way. There was a lot of happy crying those first few weeks.Just wish Iād been diagnosed in college instead of in my mid-30s. I might have graduated.
People like to throw around the word ālazyā but itās more like I canāt turn it on OR off unless Iām medicated. Once Iām in the zone I will work until I grow a beard, then wither away, then my crumbling skeleton grows a beard. It would be a powerful thing if I could aim it.
Hereās a sampling:
Gosh, the micromoments of shame really really hits home
Itās the last one for me
āJust write it downā
āIT DOESNāT FUCKING WORK!!!ā
I find the practice of making daily to-do lists still helps, not because Iāll be able to necessarily do the thing for 20 minutes on the first try, but after those 20 minutes i might look down at my little note and be able to remember what it was I was supposed to be doing⦠and then I can have another attempt at maybe doing it in the next 20 minutes.
āJust do [X]ā does not compute, whether X is āyogaā, āsportsā, ā[specific diet]ā, āthe laundryā, or simply āitā. It is never simply ājustā. The inability to ājustā start doing a thing (especially without any immediate reward) is one of the central symptoms of ADHD and if you say ājust do [X]ā, youāre essentially saying ājust donāt have ADHDā.
ADHD also doesnāt mean you are/were bad in school. Not by a long shot.
Lord Almighty, I am not lazy.
While yes, it looks like Iām sitting there on my phone, my functional part is screaming at me. Get up. Go do the thing. Do your work. You wanna get fired? Get up. Get the fuck up⦠As I click on another meme or post or video.
To add to this.
Just because i failed to act on the stuff that needs doing doesnāt mean i had it easy or that am not exhausted.
Usually the reflective awareness of my stuck state drains me way more then if i would you just be able to get up and do it.
I understand that this may come across as flippant and possibly condescending, so apologies in advance, but I mean it as a genuine question.
What would it take to break the⦠inertia?
I imagine youād move if your chair caught fire, so there must be some line. How low can the bar be set?
To be born with another brain
Neuroscience answer: Dopamine is responsible for (among other things) motivation and the feeling of reward when you do something. People with ADHD have chronically low dopamine levels because they have more dopamine transporters than most people do in their brains, so their brains burn through it quickly.
In practice, people who are unmedicated tend to do whatever they can to try and get a little more dopamine to get them through the day. Itās why smoking, risk taking, illicit drug use, gambling addiction, etc are also correlated with ADHD: all those things give you a dopamine boost.
So when someone is sitting there scrolling through memes on the phone, theyāre hunting for the dopamine. The dopamine is almost never at The Task. Itās incredibly frustrating to understand all that and still not really be able to do anything about it until it escalates into an emergency, at which point you donāt really need dopamine to deal with it anymore, now that you have adrenaline. But thatās obviously an unsustainable way to do things on a regular basis.
Depends. Are we also depressed? Is there actual anxiety tied in with that flippant apparent physical lethargy? How hot is this fire?
If you want us to do something with some consistency make us feel obligated or change it enough to keep it interesting.
Meth. Anything less will only result in eventual and catastrophic failure. Source: I have ADHD and have tried everything else, several times over.
You mean Methylphenidate? Because people when understand a different thing when you say methā¦
No, you donāt have ADHD just because you get bored sometimes.
dont like that approach since mental illnesses are typically underdiagnosed rather than overdiagnosed. If someone says they have adhd they do until proven otherwise.
Itās undiagnosed because you donāt have it. Mental health is an extremely complex thing that only somebody with the right qualifications should comment on.
just stumbled across this video and remembered out āconversationā
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4ieMzbXiRA
wow thats hostile, fuck you too buddy
I thought I was hostile until proven otherwise?
go fuck yourself you piece of shit,
a) I am officially diagnosed dont know why you assumed I wasnt
b) not everyone has equal access to healthcare and might have no choice other than to self-diagnose and medicate any range of illnesses
c) there are systemic issues like e.g. racism, sexism (sexism is double the issue in mental health than it is in physical) paired with the superiority complex of some doctors constantly leads to psychiatrists dismissing and downplaying their struggles and not diagnosing or writing prescriptions a patient needs.
but glad you keyboard warriors who never had to deal with this shit got it all figured out
āa) I am officially diagnosed dont know why you assumed I wasntā
Do you need to be officially diagnosed? Youāve made it very clear you have the power of Google and YouTube on your side.
āb) not everyone has equal access to healthcare and might have no choice other than to self-diagnose and medicate any range of illnessesā
If you could diagnose yourself you wouldnāt need any of those things.
āc) there are systemic issues like e.g. racism, sexism (sexism is double the issue in mental health than it is in physical) paired with the superiority complex of some doctors constantly leads to psychiatrists dismissing and downplaying their struggles and not diagnosing or writing prescriptions a patient needs.ā
Oh, so now I see. You donāt even need doctors because theyāre racist or something because they didnāt give you the diagnosis Google said you had.
Helps with access to medication
In a perfect world everyone would have access to what they need, until then a lot of people will have to make do with what they got and if its not a licensed doctor then google will have to do.
They did. I am officially diagnosed by a licensed psychiatrist with ADD and I get prescription medication for it. Still donāt know why you assume I am not. Yet still there a lot of doctors which are racist, sexist, transphobic and mis- or underdiagnose because of their biases. A white wealthy male doctor might have difficulty relating to a black poor woman and not understand the issue theyāre facing. On top of systemic racism, for instance itās well documented that, especially in psychiatry, a lot of the research is centered around USian college students, because those are the easiest test subjects to find, which makes the research rather biased.
And there are a lot of people that donāt even get to see a doctor due to poor health coverage who have to make do with what they find online.
What an absolute cold-blooded dismissal of other people life-altering struggles.
I also donāt like that Iām not doing the things I should be doing. Yes, I absolutely do see that those things need to be done, no I donāt think someone else is going to do them. Yes, I wish I would just get up and get it done too.
It isnāt just āstruggling to focus.ā The same way that depression isnāt just ābeing sadā and anxiety disorder isnāt just āgetting nervous.ā
When my ADHD is at its worst, I literally become almost illiterate. As in, I read a single sentence, and by the time I finish the last few words, I have completely forgotten the rest of the sentence.
I have to read that sentence 4-6 times over and over before I actually comprehend what the meaning is. The words are being sounded out in my head, but my brain doesnāt store them in short term memory, and certainly not into long term memory.
My brain is too busy processing random other things to dedicate enough attention to the thing I am trying to read. And Iām not taking about Shakespeare or Tolstoy, Iām talking about trying to read a basic email from my manager.
Imagine the feeling you had when you were in school struggling with your toughest subject. Maybe it was math, maybe chemistry, whatever. Remember what it was like when you were focusing as hard as you could to solve a problem on an exam or a homework assignment. Remember that feeling of mental exhaustion? Where it felt like your head actually hurt, you were physically tired from how hard you were focusing? Maybe for the next hour, perhaps even the rest of the day, you couldnāt think hard about anything else?
Well thatās how I feel doing the majority of trivial tasks I have to do all the time. Getting dressed, brushing my teeth, making breakfast, getting my work bag together, remembering to cash a check or pick up a few groceries. Working out, texting back a friend, responding to emails, scheduling a doctorās appointment, etc.
I start the day mentally exhausted and foggy, and I end the day even more so. And most of the things that nuro-typical folks do without hardly a thought, I have to expend final calculus 3 exam effort to do.
The most frustrating part? Sometimes, seemingly at random, my brain will just kick into gear and I will be able to focus on something for hours without any effort at all. I canāt seem to cause it to happen, I donāt know where it comes from. But on those rare days, I am a god. It actually makes me depressed, because I always think, āif I could be like this just 25% of the time, I would be unstoppable.ā
I remember one time I was hosting a party trying to read the rules for Werewolf, but had to delegate the task to someone else because I couldnāt focus on the words. I ended up just slipping out making a joke about having to take my lithium, so I could take my next dose early without being distracted and losing my Strattera pill
Oh yes, I know that experience well. Iāve had to excuse myself to discretely take another pill many times.
I reorganized my grandfatherās entire tool shed in 5 hours but the chlotes in my room are still on the ground⦠this sucks
Yep! And I canāt direct it either, which is also super frustrating. If Iām productive, itās always in a direction my brain wants to go, not where I actually need to be productive.
Itās doing something for someone else vs doing it for you. For some people, it can serve as a āhackā to engage the hyperfocus.
Aside from stimulants and therapy, learning to live with ADHD is about developing seemingly abnormal coping skills to overcome the barriers it presents. Looks weird from the outside, but it makes total sense to that person because they know it engages something within them that wonāt engage under normal circumstances.
It sucks to use and I hate it, but if someone starts doing the thing Iāve been struggling to do, that can engage my ability to do it because Iām doing it so they donāt have toā¦such as cleaning up one of my messes. Maybe you can use this too?
Please donāt ātrapā me and force my attention on to you.
I literally cannot subvert my attention from what I am focused on. Please just say my name and wait a moment for me to context switch myself.
Forcing the attention takes away from what I want to focus on and what you want me to focus on (usually you).
Iād second this as something people donāt get about ADHD.
So I work in IT support. If Iām absorbed in something complicated and you ask me to stop immediately to help you with your āmore urgentā issue, please donāt take it personally if I seem annoyed while my brain short circuits trying to deal with the sudden gear change.
Is this an ADHD thing or a normal human behavior?
Many adhd symptoms are ānormal humanā behavior/traits, but in people with adhd they are more exaggerated than in neurotypical peeps. So while something like this might be slightly annoying for a typical person, for someone with adhd it is likely worse.
In general, if someone ND is complaining about X, equating it to NT X doesnāt work. They have the same name, yes. Thatās because we donāt have words for X2 or X3 etc. Imagine if house cats, ocelots, pumas, and tigers were all called ācats.ā
āA stray cat wandered in and it looks hungry.ā
āSo, whatās the big deal? We have three cats at home. Just give them some kibble.ā
āI think it plans on eating me.ā
āStop exaggerating.ā
This also works as a reply to OPās question.
Itās worse for ADHD. Itās an outsize irritation. Also, once the focus is broken it can be really hard to pick back up the original task.
Also why we endlessly do the hip wiggle to avoid going to the loo until it hurts.
So look, I am not trying to talk down to you or make you feel inferior. The reason I use words with WAY too many syllables tucked into precisely worded sentence structures is because my fucking brain decided it didnāt want to remember the normal damn way of saying it.
Also, our brains glitch. As in it literally feels like some wires crossed. Due to this some situations/days/hours can be torture. Please be kind.
Have you ever considered not paying attention to what people say back?
If it makes you feel better, you can pretend they said good things about what you said.
I have never considered doing that at all. It happens naturally in the middle of conversations.
Yeah. I donāt actually remember anything they might have said though that reminds me: Do you have a good spaghetti recipe? Cause Iām somehow seeing a correlation between people being jerks and spaghetti right now.
Donāt worry, everyone else. We will actually return to the original topic in about 15 minutes.
Lasagna dreams, spaghetti reality.